After several email exchanges with the lay leader I have decided to go ahead and tell him where i stand. It isn't all inclusive, but here is what I sent him today:
I think the church-centered christian life (as opposed to a Christ centered christian life) that american protestantism has created in the last few generations is what is killing the church in america. and the new generations see it for what it is- empty activity that does little besides sustain itself for more empty activity. not that nothing good happens in local churches; far from it. but the abiding culture of complacency we've allowed to take over so overshadows the true mission of God's people that we risk losing it all.
we need corporate worship, we need corporate teaching, we need fellowship. But, we also need to get the heck out of the church building and live lives that show we care about somebody in addition to the people we worship with. we must address this corporate addiction to church that we ourselves have created. call it a church intervention, maybe. and if we succeed, the withdrawals will be ugly, angry, and very messy. If we don't succeed, thousands of local churches just like ours will be gone in 20 years or less. I'm not even sure if that isn't what should happen.
that is what i think.
I hope he doesn't choke when he reads it.
39 comments:
I get to be the first to say Bravo!!!
I have never heard it expressed more eloquently.
thank you Grace. That means more than you know. maybe I should write with a migraine more often. :-/
Awesome, Cindy.
Before my church merged with another (as I've detailed on my blog), this was clearly what was happening - the church was doomed to die a slow death, with leadership that put the church first, not Jesus - to put it another way, idolatry of the church.
Good for you - I know you did this with much prayerful consideration. More churches need to hear this kind of message.
Whoo-hoo! Wow, you amaze me, Cindy. To sum everything up in two paragraphs like that - wowzers! Like Grace said...
I sure hope the fallout from that isn't too ugly...but I'm glad you told the truth. It has to be like a weight lifted...do you suddenly feel free?
andy- thank you. i'm so glad to hear your church is on track now!
erin- i just received a kind reply from the church leader. he said that while he doesn't agree with all that I wrote (he did call it radical), he doesn't claim to have all the answers and that he appreciated my honesty. I suppose that's about as good as I could hope for.
I wish it felt like a weight coming off, but it doesn't. I don't expect him to share my thoughts with the church, because he knows it would probably fare badly for us if the truth became too widespread! Maybe it will give him a little more food for thought as he proceeds with considerations for the future.
Cindy,
In two paragraphs you have summarized what most of us have been feeling for years. We can all stop blogging now, and just post this. :D
In all seriousness, though...very, very well said, and given humbly. Thank you for sharing it.
"I wish it felt like a weight coming off, but it doesn't." I think this is a significant statement, given the leaders' guarded response. That tells you this isn't over just because you spoke your mind. Either God may have you say more at some point, or you may want to be prepared for some fallout. Either way...let me say again: Well said.
(Hmm. Maybe I should have done this anonymously. I don't know if I want people to see me posting comments on the blog of a "radical." :) Sorry about your migraine.)
thanks so much jeff. when i read that he called my thoughts radical i realized it was best that I had decided to hold back on my controversial ideas! i thought, "gee, if that's radical, he'd really get a shock from most of the blogs I read!"
Yey! Cindy! Well written. I'm sorry that it doesn't feel like a weight is off your shoulders though.
Why is it a lot of leaders see taking these steps as radical? It's not really - to me it's simply being a follower of Christ. As Andy wrote, it's idolatry of the church - the building etc.
Maybe you have given him some food for thought that he will mull over for a few days and have a change of heart .... although, the cynic in me isn't holding my breath on that one. I'm far too cynical these days.
thanks, lyn! i think cynicism just comes with the territory as we're feeling our way through all of this. I try to resist it, too, but sometimes it just seeps through the cracks. well that didn't come out like i thought it would... you know what i mean. :-)
I guess one reason i'm not emotional about this (besides the fact that it feels like a grenade went off in my brain) is that i didn't have any expectations tied up in my statement. he indicated he'd like me to be honest, and, like jim said over at his blog, don't ask the question unless you want an honest answer...
i tried not to be too crass without watering down the truth. if the church were to brand me a heretic and fire us immediately, we'd miss the $100 a week they pay us for our various responsibilities, but i wouldn't feel especially rejected because i'm perfectly content with my stance in this matter. for years now i've gone out of my way not to impose my views on our church. it isn't their fault that i found a new perspective along the way.
but this time was different. this time the chairman of the administrative board asked a direct question and honestly wanted an answer. as far as i can tell, the ball has left my side of the court.
Cindy, as others have already stated, those are two great paragraphs.
Sometimes I think it would be a good start to even really care about the people we worshiped with.
We are about half-way through a "capital campaign" and I was recently asked to make a video for church to kind of pump people up and remind them to keep giving.
The person said, a lot of people have dropped off and some have had situations change, like their house is in foreclosure.
I wanted to say, "Then why don't we give the money to them."
Anyway, I am rambling now, but once again someone has put feelings that many of us are having to very eloquent words. Thanks.
thanks, Chad. the strange dynamics of church life never cease to amaze me. another confirmation that church shouldn't be our life?
Cindy ~
I am proud of you for being honest without being unloving, brief, but darn eloquent, spot on without being unduly critical. These two paragraphs will experience a lot of copying and pasting.
I wonder where the journey you are beginning will wind up for you and your church. Anyhow, you are on a good journey!
Way to go!
Keep me posted.
Well, I'm late to the party, but I'll add my "Amen!" to everyone else's. You said it so well, I think I'll go paste it up on my blog!
Glenn- thank you. i don't think anyone has ever said i was spot on about anything before! who knows- this journey may wind up with me out on my ear, but i'm okay with that, too! i honestly don't think my words will have any effect at my church at all, but the affirmation i've received here has warmed my heart!
maria- thank you so much! and you're not late at all. lately i've been commenting on posts that are 2 weeks old- yours may have been one of them come to think of it! i've been so behind...
It blows me away to think about how many churches in America don't talk about Jesus. Why are the mainstream denominations dying today?
Because they've forgotten about the Gospel.
If your ideas are "radical", Cindy, it's because Jesus was radical. Too many of our churches today are lazy and Pharasaical, and require the radical obedience to Jesus that He calls us to.
After all, delayed obedience is disobedience (something I have recently learned)...
andy- so true- the actual gospel has, in many cases, left the building. and you're right- legalism is the lazy way, although legalistic folks would claim they are working very hard...
and about this: "delayed obedience is disobedience"
ouch. just ouch.
Cindy, the only thing I respect more than the eloquent and prophetic honesty of your words is that you said them as someone who still belongs to the very congregation you are challenging. That says a lot. I have always respected that commitment. Thanks for modeling this for us.
Peace,
Jamie
As mentioned in a comment over at Erin's post; this is fantastic.
Great words and a wonderful message.
jamie- thank you so much. i don't know what to say. i don't deserve special respect for any of this. but thank you.
jeff- i appreciate that so much. thank you.
I came across your blog via the Spiritual Birdwatching blog. Just wanted to say that you answered a difficult question with true clarity and honesty. Truly a great summary of where the church needs to go. I can tell it was delivered with a heart that is full of passion for her church. Thank you.
I see why Erin linked here today! :)
geoff
thanks for taking time to come by and for the kind words!
barbara- thanks! erin is a good friend. the best friend i have with pink hair, in fact. :-)
Cindy,
Just found this post (and your blog) through Glenn's blog.
As others have said, very eloquently stated, and very concise.
Think I will go post this on my blog as well...
Thank You!
Rainer, thank you! I'm glad you came by.
Cindy, as a pastor, thank you! (It's much the same here in the UK), we need to be told the truth, because, although it may hurt or upset the apple cart, it's the way Jesus wants us to go. I hope and pray that those paragraphs of yours become a seed for something which can become a beacon of hope to those stuck in worship of Church, not of Jesus. Thank you...
Mark Salmon: UK
Mark, I'm honored by your words. I appreciate your openness, as a pastor, to these thoughts.
"But, we also need to get the heck out of the church building and live lives that show we care about somebody in addition to the people we worship with."
well, I am choking over this!
YEAH!
I hope that they have eyes to see and ears to hear....
and, "you go girl!"
(that's what the teenagers I work with would say....:) )
just read through your comments....
RADICAL???????
wow. do they even read their bibles anymore?
I live for the days of feeding the hungry, clothing the naked, loosening the chains of the oppressed.........
can't do that in a church full of people already fed, clothed and FREE.......um, can ya????
sorry.
but you know, you planted the seeds.....maybe the rain will come, the sun, and in time there will grow something beautiful...
Wow! Cindy! I just came back to read the comments again...all I can say is WOW!
tera rose- thank you!
I agree- what I wrote wasn't radical at all, but I do live in the bible belt. we just got to the point that some places don't think you're going to hell for wearing jeans to church... I honestly don't know if I've planted a seed or not. Not sure where to go from here...
yeah - that's what I think as well, as Buzz Light Year once said, to infinity and beyond.
I wonder why it is always so great when we find another heart who echoes what is in our own? Loved this post, and especially loved your courage to say it straight out and not water it down.
mork- you and Buzz are right!
tracey- thanks. i don't know what i'd do without the encouragement i find here from like minded people. it saves me, and that's no exaggeration.
Thank you for saying what is in the heart of so many of us.
Deb
thank you Deb! I'm glad you came by :-)
so....out of curiosity, "where are you today?" ....in regards to this post. myself and others were involved with a pentecostal type church whose leadership thought themselves and it's congregatin as being radical. there was "sin in the camp".....amongst the leaders! illegal too!!! i loved the praise and worship time. God really uses the music leaders when they're following His Spirit in worship. ....i've been filled often in just the praise and worship times. so, where are you today in relationship to this post? any praise reports?
Ramsey,
I'm sorry, but not surprised, to say that nothing has changed. Our church isn't abusive (far from it) or doing anything illegal, unethical, or even questionable. We're on the same track that so many other protestant churches are on. It isn't bad, per se, I just don't think it's the right track.
Post a Comment